sell 210 to push

[Kreutertee]

https://entgaming.net/findstats.php?id=10046861
nico, level 9, sell 2x skeletor (210g) to push, suiciding pointless anyway.

[nicolai123]

Wow i got 4 gold more than i was supposed to, literally had 0 impact on game. You think that is worth a report but in very same game you solo sent and lost us game. You sir are a special kind of retarded.

[Kreutertee]

It's not about the gold you get, but the time and eventually the lumber you get by pushing 30 seconds earlier, since you had no gold for it.

That's the lame abuse everyone seems to tolerate. Well, I don't
Lame gameplay, while there are clear rules against.

And please dont argue "skele dead value". it's not like aqua is eceptionally strong 10+ with low range, slow attack animation. Yet not everybody just sells his value. You had solid income, solid value, and went for unnecessary suicide.

Anyway, your noob-ass suicide/clog/whatever gameplay isn't on trial here, your unit selling for >200g is.

[nicolai123]

"Aqua=skeleton" you heard it here first folks.

[Im_Halp]

"Aqua=skeleton" you heard it here first folks.

Some would say I would agree with this lol

[Anda]

i didnt check replay, but tbh kreut is right if you sell over 200 u get punished. its like starting a race a few inches in front or a bit 2 early, will get you disqualified, no matetr if you would have win the race or not ?
and as a suicider 1 lj upgrade is a big difference
its same like u make if u build 130 g for delay with polar and oh i didnt know but its only 10 g over it id say.

[HazarDous]

Selling 210 and rebuilding 10 is ok. But no rebuild isn't, nothing malicious like selling >210 though, so...

Unvouched 1 day.

[Kreutertee]

Selling 210 and rebuilding 10 is ok. But no rebuild isn't, nothing malicious like selling >210 though, so...

@HazarDous
Isn't that exactly contrary to what the rules say? The rule seems very clear to me.

Code: Select all

Only exception is King Claw. Selling towers worth more than 200g and then rebuilding to compensate is not allowed!


Can you please elaborate?

[HazarDous]

Thanks @kreutertee

My understanding is that this rule rewording is only aimed at suppressing the false notion that selling 400 on a race level (i.e. 15) and rebuilding 200 is OK, given this false notion had gained a lot of popularity in the past month(s). In other words, the precedent established [url=https://entgaming.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=207&t=117986&p=459373&hilit=self+regulating#p459373[/url] by 3 moderators, stating that selling slightly more than 200 and rebuilding the difference in order to suicide, is still valid. I do understand the confusion with the rule update, though, and I will discuss it with @MickeytheMousie

tl;dr; TBD. No impact on this specific request so there may not be a follow up here. We'll probably announce it if there's an update to the rule.

[Kreutertee]

Thanks. I didn't mean any impact or more drama for this request, it just confused me as it seemed contrary to the rules.

Feel free to drag those last 3 comments in a new thread, as it's a more general question, probably relevant for a broader audience.

[dweiler]

First of all, bear in mind that my rulebook is still a proposal, there are some new things in there that weren't rules/differently handled in the past, which is why I asked people to comment on them. One of those rules is this.

I see both points on selling 210 as a suicider, on the one hand is does not really make a difference, because if you sell 210, you must build back 10gold, even thought you only got 5 gold extra, so you are losing on it, which is not in the favour of a suicider (but is for a clogger). On the other hand, by selling another skeletor, which is not allowed by the rules, he got an advantage of pushing earlier, which someone who sticks to the rules would not have gotten.

Although you may find arguments to excuse someone selling more than 200g, in my new proposal I just want to make the rules clear and not-debatable. In this case, is selling 220g ok? selling 280g ok? How can players know when to report or not, because they are depending on what the mod finds reasonable. If we just have a clear rule, '200 gold no more' and everyone knows, this problem is gone, because everyone knows that if they sell 210gold they are violating the rule. It becomes a mess and depending on which moderator you get otherwise, who finds what reasonable.

[FadingSuns]

selling nm is allowed. Unit cost 215 and would be a great disadvantaje to not be able to suicide with nm when u can with any other t5. Please apply common sense instead try to chase others....

[Meshtar]

Make it allowed max 200 and any t5 tower? I think Mick is right about people not being able to tell where is the limit on reasonable sell and will be again a moderator decision per case, which doesn't help lihl players at all. Need a firm limit imo, whatever it is decided to be the limit.

[dweiler]

selling nm is allowed. Unit cost 215 and would be a great disadvantaje to not be able to suicide with nm when u can with any other t5. Please apply common sense instead try to chase others....

1. Currently it is not allowed, I don't know where you get your information from. If you don't agree you should have read my proposal to the rules instead of coming here now with the wisdom.

Do not sell more than 200 value during a single level with the intent to push and/or leak more. Only exception is King Claw. Selling towers worth more than 200g and then rebuilding to compensate is not allowed!

2. Your opinion is not common sense, it is your opinion, setting a firm limit on 200 is just as much common sense as allowing 215, it is just a different choice.

Btw I don't mind changing the rule to selling unupped t5's too, I am just not in favor of making it based on 'common sense' or 'moderator's opinion', it is too random.

[Kreutertee]

Thanks for the clarification. I personally like simple rules and therefore would support for 200g, no more, no matter what - except king Claw/bottom feeder.

Since suiciding should only be a last resort, allowing for example "sell any T5 without upgrade" just further enables and encourages random suicide play. I'm no fan of it, but then again, as long as the rules are clear, I'm happy to play along

Oh, and let's look ahead to new map, time stealer for 220 value?!