Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

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Change current dota map to fixed gold version

Change
13
72%
Don't change
5
28%
 
Total votes: 18

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Panopticon
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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby Panopticon » Mon Sep 24, 2018 6:14 am

I'm all for the change.
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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby Letbell » Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:51 pm

31% of people who doesn't wanna change probably been abusing this passive glitch =P
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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby Sylvanas » Tue Sep 25, 2018 3:21 am

Good, good!

We need even more votes to make the "don't change" side feel bad about what they've done. But don't worry about it you guys, you too can change your vote and become part of the solution.

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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby FalenGa » Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:58 pm

Wasn't the passive gold gain always supposed to be counted/distributed per tick, with tick being equal to 0.6 - 0.7 seconds, instead of per second?

Do i simply remember this wrong, or was this bug introduced way before 1.29? I am talking 5-6 years back.


Edit* I was curious, so i watched a couple of dota 1 videos on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8fmtmnFQ1E
This one was uploaded at 2015. The pgg seems to be the same as now, which is 1 gold ( non-em ) per tick, with tick being something like 0.6 to 0.7 seconds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NE0ZbieSBC0
Uploaded at 2011. Same deal as above.

A quick google search brings this up.
https://dota2.gamepedia.com/Gold

Periodic gold
Each player receives 1 unreliable gold every 0.66 seconds (starting from 0:00 on the game clock), which results in 91 gold every minute. Some heroes may pick talents that increase that base rate.

Obviously, that's from dota 2, so please ignore that if it was a dota 2 specific change. I was just too lazy to search more than 1 page.

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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby Sylvanas » Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:33 pm

You know what, you're absolutely right about regular dota. The gold gain is 1 per .66 second, so basically 3 per 2 seconds. I have forever falsely assumed regular mode was 1/second and em was 2/second and it turns out neither are true. Unfortunately, I'm unable to google any precise data for the gold gain in em.

Checking out old youtube games was a great idea, so I went and found an old em game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBJXP9XLIc8
If you go to 1:51, you can see that the player's remaining gold after buying items is 48. The gold and time ticks are paced differently, but I believe the gold and game time ticks at 30 seconds of game time (2:24 in video) are exactly synchronized. At that moment, void has 118 gold, so he gained 70 gold over 30 second, or 2.33 gold per second. Since this is a fairly round number, all seems to indicate that this is the real, intended gold gain amount. Edge could probably go and confirm in the code of one of the older maps. Actually the patch probably messed them up too, so I think 2.33 per second would be a nice target.

Meanwhile, the current map seems to give 102-104 gold over 30 seconds (synchronized so it's between those 2 values), based on my last replay, indicating gold gain is currently in the 3.4-3.466/second range. So the glitch is very much still there, except the actual numbers were all wrong and the new map should be set to 2.33 gold per second. Thanks for pointing this out.

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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby Unitil » Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:12 pm

Here is an archive of a site that goes over DotA gold for reliable/unreliable sources. This includes timed gold which is categorized as unreliable.

https://web.archive.org/web/20150423135412/http://www.playdota.com/mechanics/Gold

Good ol’ site archives.

Code: Select all

Every 0.6 seconds each player is given 1 unreliable gold (2 in easy mode) this results in 5 gold each 3 seconds.


If your estimate of 102 - 104 gold over 30 seconds is accurate, then it is functioning as it should for em modes.

10 gold over 3 seconds
30 seconds / 3 seconds = 10
10 x 10 gold = 100 gold

This is within the ball park you have mentioned.

The technical average we are looking at is 10 gold per 3 seconds for em mode.

10g/3s = 3.33 g/s

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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby Sylvanas » Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:58 pm

Going through the different captures from that page, I can see it has been changed multiple times over the years. Looks like the current amount predates 1.29, and had been intended. Yet I clearly remember the gold going up noticeably faster than normal after 1.29, did I just imagine this? Maybe that belief spread through suggestion?

So 1.29 happened, I overheard that passive gold was glitched and was twice as fast as normal. I checked and sure enough, it was going twice (my assumption, as suggested) as fast as before, when it was only 2 gold per second (also my assumption, due to popular belief). So this happens. Then this happens. This would be so fascinating if I didn't feel like such a ditz.

Oh well. Sorry.
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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby BeerLord » Wed Sep 26, 2018 3:07 am

I remember a change.. though not exactly when... For many years I used to farm an ult stick for zeus by level 11. Then suddenly it changed to level 8 (where it is today). I also remember that rather than favoring the auto attacking noob 30 minute radiance players like me, it actually seemed to favor the elite players, since, they are so much better at farming. They would get 6 slotted in ridiculous times...

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Re: Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

Postby FalenGa » Wed Sep 26, 2018 6:34 pm

You shouldn't be apologising for suggesting to fix a bug and spreading awareness. Mistakes happen.

Anyway, since the map update is no longer required, i will process this suggestion.


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