Reevaluation of Vendeta/fiji report.

[Anda]

team 2 vendeta / fiji / clear sude. Rolls are meatwagons with wyvern, raider with polar and acolyte, heli alpha parasite and aqua.
Team 2 double ea, nightmare, priso mixed with rev.
Both team warri send, team 1 mid is 2 ea, priso with rev, team 2 mid is geomancer meatwagon, raider acolyte.
I try to copy from the chat only what i feel relevant to show why i came to the conclusion at the end of this review.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: htey will OB for level 4
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: they are gonna anticipate level 4 send sadly :s
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: we could go 5 like tards
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: if we can muster any Bo spam<- no response or any tactic input from the other members.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: imo lets hard 5 like tards<-- during level 2, again no response, Team 2 freeleaks level 2, big time for lumberbank
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: lets make them burn heal on 5
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: they will get immolla cos of 2x archer-this is sad at start of wave 3
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: if we get thorn
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: we die
clear leaks 16 on 3, even more time for lumber.
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: i die
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: now
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: only if we let them control the game
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: they will OB hard for 4 for sure
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: np
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: we gonna need one ON on 5<--- strong intention to convince team to send 5
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: thats all i can say<-- made his point.
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: ok that leak <-- freeleak 3
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: kills us
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta:
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: we cant 5<-- loud and clear no 5
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: we can
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: we die 5<-- again
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: only if we get immolla we die
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: w8 skill then<--- NO blind send 5.At this point 2 people say NO to a blind 5 send,fiji feels is it mandatoy, sude did not say anything towards the call.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: green and clear can go mid together ez<-- wrong ,as all leak
Team 1 leaks 4 free again, more time for lumber again
(00:00 / Allied) sude: gogo?<-- question, doesnt mean its yes or no.For me its more in the no send direction since the whole strategy is based on ea getting 2 immo which is a 25 % chance. I would never support that send fiji wants without knowing my own teamspell. But this is my opinion, i can not read sudes mind.So during wave 4 stands:
2 people against a blind send 5, 1 wants it, 1 is undecided. That is a majority against a 5 send.Fiji forces the send during 4 blind, which is a clear rule violation.This can also be judged as refusal to teamplay or intentional tk.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: yes fuck it
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: they comin 5
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: dont let them control anything
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: we will get stomp
Clear misses the inc from the send, it ends up being a full send by both teams.Round 5 starts,both teams end up with Immola.
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: zzz
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: gg
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: pro
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: we got immolla lol
team 1 leaks 40 team 2 leaks 52
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: idk why u forced that crapiest send ever<-- This is simply the truth. It is forced against majority and it is indeed a tk call.From all the info shown team 1 is a lot stronger on 5 then team 2. Full send is pure tk call.It is not toxic to call out that someone stood over major team decision and just completely ignores other votes. The result that both teams end up with immo is pure coincidence, there was no guarantee to this situation.I would be mad at that point aswell.Ofc this triggers fiji, but it is still the truth.Nobody would argue against this sentence if it came from clear, which was clearly overvoted and disregarded in the same matter.
00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: ty<-- to vendetas statement
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: immolla
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: doesnt matter immola
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: well atleast they have immolla also<-- this is a good job from fiji. he states out the obvious, hence trying to calm down the situation and work towards a better end of the game. This is happening during kc of vendeta
Team 1 burns 2, Team 2 burns 3 heals. I myself do not KC so i asked for help here. I was assured that the 3rd heal could have been avoided by better kc.
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: sad<- 2v3 heals used
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: 2-2 not sad<- true , 2v2 heals vs 2 ea is better situation then safeplay up early and giving them the freegold and 4 heals aswell.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: KC was sad<-- that is true but what to gain from this ? All you do is trigger vendeta here.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: we could onehit them
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: earlier
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: and saved this heal
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: xD
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: i did everything good<-- wrong, not sure if you are mad here because your called on the spot or because you rly feel you did good kc.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: yes
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: untill the point where there were a few onehitters
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: just the call was terrible<-- still true, but the 3rd heal is on you
00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: it wanst
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: it was gonna be 2-2
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: sure was
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: it aint nigga
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: yeah
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: our 3rd heal was not needed
00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: jesus
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: ofc no
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: srsly
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: 2-2 not bad call<-- result doesnt make it a good or bad call.It ended up like this by pure luck.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: but now its 3-2
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: not any heal needed if u just dont force send
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: just stop <-- tries to end the blame on kc here.I dont see this as triggering anybody.Vende is wrong on the kc, but he dont see it or is mad. still the right thing to call for a stop of the discussion / blame situation and work forward.
(00:00 / Allied) clearfluids: lol
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: u wanna just bend over
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: u made us bend over
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: and recive it form 2x archer / immolla ?
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: no
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: ur kc made us use heal
(00:00 / Allied) HazarDous: king ?
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: ur call made us
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: naw
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: go 7
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: was good ccall but bad kc
(00:00 / Allied) BA_Fail: yea
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: lets send here niggas
(00:00 / Allied) Vendeta: shut up<-- This is toxic. You still wanna end the discussion, but you trigger him here hard.That is not okay. Both of you had plenty of time to stop use the !ignore command until now, to communicate with the other members and work towards deescalating the situation / play the game.This is not the right way to actand the fault here is at you.
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: stfu
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: kid
(00:00 / Allied) ZTX)Fiji: u have no idea how to play<-- now it escalate.
I could go on further with the chatlog, but quite frankly i made my points already to come to my conclusion.From here on our, you both violate the rules clearly. You both have that i dont take shit from anybody attitude There is some more triggering from vendeta, there is more snapping from fiji. Vende tried to calm it down sometimes again, but it was 2 late.You are both at fault for this.
What is not vendetas fault is the excessive flaming fiji uses here. I also dont accept those words vs me and would have reported this myself. Nobody needs to swallow such words.We as mods tell Vendeta if stuff like this happens report it, dont flame back. he did precisely what he has been told by moderation staff plenty of times, and i see nothing wrong in this.


So here is my final conclusion:
Fiji: You forced send against clear team veto,you teamkilled intentionally, you griefed a lot and you flamed in an unexcusable way. You didnt use the ignore option when it was the best to do and prefeered to continue this war.Also regarding your ban history i will have to ban you for another week adding up to the 3 days ive already banned you for.
Vendeta:Your kc was not good, you fail to admit that fact or you dont see it. You behaved in general better then fiji, but you also amde flaws. Use the ignore command if you find yourself stuck in a situation like this. Dont ever tell people to shut up anything. At that point, you really made it worse and are to blame for that.
I will unvouch you for 48 hours due to triggering/hindering the teamplay.You have a reputation of this, but your LIHL history is clean. This is the maximum bantime i feel fit to use.


I will not ban either of you 2 though because you both have stated that you forgive each other and will work on normally towards future time, no holds grudged. You resolved this player by player, which is what we encourage our community to do. Try your best to get good again, if that doesnt work come here and report/ search for clearance.I dont feel anything is won by taking the opportunity to play on from either of you. I hope the lesson is learned.

Regarding the response to this case the moderation staff will come up with some announcements in the following days.
Processing

[KiwiLeKiller]

Is this the same game that was reported before? I don't see the need of such a thread.

Who is reporting what here?

Also, I don't like the fact that you are analyzing almost every single thing said, maybe the meaning of it is not what was originally intended to be.

Finally, KC is hard, especially on 5 when it's hard to click specific units which are low hp because they have strange hit-box and because the health bars are so close to each others that it's difficult to see what creep is low hp.

To admit you made some mistakes with KC is not mandatory as far as I know. Of course it would probably have benefited in this situation, but blaming is never a good thing to do anyway. People should always focus on the future instead of the past.

[Wolke]

Thx for your work anda

[Don_Killuminati]

Lol, Vendeta made all theses messes about KC to fail it without saying 'sorry' ?
Kc is sure hard, but you should expect more from someone with a big mouth, and failing without saying 'sorry' is maybe not something bannable, but its sure very very bad mannered.

[Anda]

Yes it is the same game hat was reported before. I did this because i was unsatisfied with my results the first time which i thought i had to judge like i did due to a misinterpretation of the mod rules.. I did this to show that you also can not interpret lobby-chat without looking at the replay.That is just missing a good part of context and the main reason a chat happens... talking about the game played. Hard to exclude the actual content of the talk from its judgement and consider it valid.People were jumping to conclusions and essaying pretty much opinion based analysis to a good part.Nobody is innocent here, but the way people were insisting their view on a situation to be true, which i proved to be false in my review here.
We are working on a discussing internally how we will proceed in the future with forum reports and the way we / and the communities handles it so we can avoid drama in the future.