Reporting dafuker

[Psyclone]

Hi,

Reluctantly, because drama induced by reports should be kept on a low level but at the same time driven by my sense of justice, I report dafuker for not drawing the game after ranzkopp has lost the connection. By his actions, he violated the following LIHL rule:

If a team misses a player by disconnect or leaving before the end of level 20, it is mandatory to !draw the game, unless every player agrees to play on.


Not drawing was not only a violation of LIHL rules but also a flagrant infringement of the unwritten ethic codes prevalent in our community. I don't deny that we would have died regardless but first, this was not obvious at the time he resumed the game (we could have had immolation) and secondly does not legitimate his actions by any means (the rule is very clear here). How many times have we drawn games which would have been won 100 percently otherwise? Exactly. I hope he gets his punishment but more than that I hope that this does never occur again.

(00:25 / All) dafuker: i dont draw

Stats link: https://entgaming.net/findstats.php?id=10539068

Please do not misunderstand this as an invitation to express your opinion on the case. The moderators have everything they need.

[sonycrockett]

Dont we agreed on nn draw when someone dc on race lvl? cuz this special case was obvious win. And imo manner is take the lost like men.
Anyway If u think i deserve huge ban i can trade with it

[sonycrockett]

Dont we agreed on nn draw when someone dc on race lvl? cuz this special case was obvious win. And imo manner is take the lost like men.
Anyway If u think i deserve huge ban i can trade with it

[MudMan]

everyone is allowed to express their opinion

I believe dafuker doesnt deserve ban, even @hazardous said so too on discord after the game drama.

Just imagine ranz dced 20 seconds later during the round than he already did, it was still obvious that they die, a draw is not needed in that case.

this seems like a revenge report despite being 2 hours post game end.

Otherwise, anyone is just capable of fake dcing if an unexpected send happens which confirms a team's loss. Keep in mind im not accusing ranz of purposely dcing, just saying that it was a way too convenient coincidence if game was to be drawn...

Also, the fake dc will not result in a ban because theres no way to prove it was intentional, but instead the dcer can just gamble on whether the people will report DC PEN or not, and therefore possibly save their elo.

[HazarDous]

It's more complicated then that, and I didn't say this doesn't deserve a ban. I said I'd feel bad reporting fuker for this..

Yes, we were going to die, but neither did dafuker nor anyone in our team knew about it at the time ranz disconnected. Not too sure what to think about waiting to see if team dies before drawing or not.

It is true however that ranz's d/c had 0 effect on the game, it would have ended with or without his pro KC or his wood. I think fuker's logic is valid and I would have agreed not to demand a draw had he explained his point of view during the pause. Not a fan of his lack of communication and the disregard for others he constantly demonstrates..

These sort of draw vs no draw situations are hands down the most complicated cases to judge when you are a moderator... do you go lenient on fuker because he was right that the game was over? What about the fact he waited to see immo or not before refusing to draw? Does it matter or not? If we give him a lenient ban length, does it give the message that you can refuse to draw when you think enemy team dies?

I remember I argued for a long long time with @fadingsuns and @mickeythemousie about that when fate did the same very same thing. IIRC, we agreed that because it is impossible to draw a line and for players to enforce it in-game, any d/c requires to draw the game, regardless of the specific situation. The correct thing to do here would really to rely on people's sportsmanship and pause the game, discuss, and agree on whether or not the game should be drawn or whether it is a loss and the losing team should just take it.

Having someone on your team d/c, trying to draw, not caring to up or control the king because game should be drawn, having someone on enemy team refuse to draw, unpausing the game without even stating his PoV, etc. You can't really keep up with what's happening and you end up not knowing whether you'd have died or not. All of that is a pain in the ass, and in another situation where it would have been more close, I would definitely have reported dafuker myself. In other words, his logic is OK, his manners are very bad.

[MudMan]

Yes, we were going to die, but neither did dafuker nor anyone in our team knew about it at the time ranz disconnected. Not too sure what to think about waiting to see if team dies before drawing or not.

Dafuker already announced that the only reason he didnt draw was because u said "we thorn and dead anyway" as soon as ranz dced

Spoiler!

(00:00 / All) HazarDous: thormail no mid

The correct thing to do here would really to rely on people's sportsmanship and pause the game, discuss, and agree on whether or not the game should be drawn or whether it is a loss and the losing team should just take it.

100% agree with you, this is the ideal thing to do, but in the heat of the moment, i guess no one took the time to think about it

[nukid]

heyheyhey,

soooooooooo,
first of all any1 with an IQ > 30 should realize that me PPing there is the worst option i have xD, so ye sorry for the DC and sorry for the lost elo,(dont report me huehue).
as much as i like le fukker and see hazas arguments here this seems pretty easy to me.
the ruleset is clear as fuck...nothing to argue about

if the loosing team has the balls to sell/loose the game thats great but that will rarely happen...

if i was still ingame and some1 else dropped i wouldve agreed to KC and see if we live or the missing woods n shiet would prevent us from dying. if whole team agrees great.
If there is no such agreement then again, the ruleset is clear.

i see what haza is saying that this stuff in theory is tuff to handle but that is exactly why the rule stands as it is dont u think? x_x

that PP on purpose when i loose theory mud is mentioning seems stupid to me aswell, any1 who cares about their elo wouldnt risk that for themselfs exept you would PP for another person like Fate Tks me for wolke and n1ll3 when i play against them. but other than Fate i dont think we have a lot of people in this league who are willing to do such unsportsmanlike sort of things soooooooooooooooooooooooooooo all of that beeing said....

fukki usually knows what hes doing and as far as i believe doesnt really give a fuck about the consequences of his behavior...

he has a history of doing stupid things like that lately but given this case was pretty annoying for his whole team(sorry again) i would not be too harsh on him.

[MudMan]

Didn't accuse u of purposely pping, just saying it's a convenient coincidence. Even u said it itself "my pc read my mind"
And as someone mentioned on discord "if we let this one slide then it will open doors to people refusing to draw" implying that this happens regularly (a dc right before death) which is not true because this is a very rare case.

[Meshtar]

And as someone mentioned on discord "if we let this one slide then it will open doors to people refusing to draw" implying that this happens regularly (a dc right before death) which is not true because this is a very rare case.

You shouldn't avoid naming names. I am that someone apparently so I'll just clarify since you are miss-quoting me for the tenth time already. I never said its a regular thing I just said it happened a few times already during my time in LIHL and that is only counting the cases that ended up as reports on forum. There were games that were never reported where the clearly losing team took the loss as it was obvious who was gonna lose. Maybe not 100% similar to this one, but there were cases where one team fail sends 15 and then would 100% die and lose to 17 send for example but then someone dc-ed so people had the choice to take the loss or demand a draw. Saying that is a different case is just arguing semantics cause both teams know it 100% ends 17 with a predictable outcome. I'd say that I alone was in 10-ish such games so far, so I can imagine how many have been in total. I have also been in games where my team would have won 100% but we drawed the game and moved on.
So I agree with Haza completely, as I said it in discord right after the game. Game needed to be paused and our team asked to take the loss since we die anyway. If we refuse to do it then draw the game, post it in season highlights to mock us and call us out for not taking a loss, or something like that. For everything there is a right and a wrong way. Fuker chose the wrong way, so even if I wouldn't have reported him myself I do think that this report sets the right example for future, as some other reports before this one did. What we need to do though is start setting things right in game by being more sportsmanlike and not having to do this crap on forum.

[Anda]

The ruleset is indeed very clear, if there is a dc before level 20 ends draw is mandatory.
I also believe this could have been paused and discussed,one can consider it fairplay to ff the game when it was lost at the same level no matter what. Talking about heat of the moment when you actively resume the paused game to force it to end is precisely the opposite of fair play, very nefarious behaviour.
Guideline is 3 days, youve been banned for this exact rulebreak before and seems you are not willing to learn a lesson from it.
dafuker unvouched for 5 days.