Implement fixed passive gold gain dota version

[Sylvanas]

Map link

It's as the title says. For those who don't know, the 1.29 wc3 patch altered the passive -em gold gain in the 6.93d dota map version that is currently hosted by ENT, increasing it to an unacceptable 3⅓ gold per second (as confirmed just now). Viewing it as an abomination to the LORD that could not be tolerated, Edgeofchaos lowered it back down to the much less controversial 2/second. My suggestion is to replace the current dota map by this vastly superior fixed version.

PROS: Gold gain is back to the intended amount.

CONS: None.

KNOWN GLITCHES: The same as before, minus the gold glitch. Progress!

[Merex]

Don't see a need for this.

[Sylvanas]

Don't see a need for this.

A 1 gold per second difference constitutes the main difference between em and non-em. Every mod should know by now that everyone loses their minds whenever somebody suggests switching from em to non-em. When an extra 1⅓ gold just kind of randomly gets added up on top due to a glitch, why would you just shrug and say it's nothing? What if the next patch increases it more? Is there a specific amount that will make you care? The fix is right here, when did ENT decide they didn't care about glitches?

[Zeratul]

Haven't tried the map yet, but given the comments made by Edge, the only changed aspect was the gold gain per second, which was broken due to the wc3 patch (Mapmaker made it 1g/sec on non -em, and 2g/sec on -em; patch broke it making it 4g/sec, which is different than the intended one by the mapmaker - One could almost say we're all exploiting a glitch on the map, who knows)

Anyways, +1 - it's a simple fix to the current broken map, there's no reason to deny it

[EdgeOfChaos]

Also if you choose to implement this and you don't trust my map for whatever reason, anyone with JASSCraft and an MPQ Editor can do it. Line 92345 of script, change:

Code: Select all

call TriggerRegisterTimerEvent(EW0,0.6,true)

->

Code: Select all

call TriggerRegisterTimerEvent(EW0,1.0,true)

Done on map DotA v6.83d-fixed.w3x

[Sylvanas]

Changed title so people can better tell what this suggestion is about from the front page

I'd like to see the opinion of regular dota players from the mod team.

@beerlord
@falenga
@slomosapien

or any others

[BeerLord]

I would support this if that is what the community wanted. Perhaps a survey/vote?

[Sylvanas]

I would support this if that is what the community wanted. Perhaps a survey/vote?

Added, do vote now.

Personally I think this should be a technicality, as it is a non-choice between fixed and broken, but if a poll should better ensure this gets done, a poll there will be.

Edit: can somebody flush down this thread in the dota board? I accidentally made 2.

[kunkka]

Don't see a need for this.

Why? Cuz it’s just fine now?

[Sylvanas]

Why? Cuz it’s just fine now?

This is what I'm wondering. Who are the people who watch the map get progressively bastardized by various glitches and who fight those who want to restore it? Should these recent b.net patches and the glitches they bring dictate the way the map is played, even though solutions are being provided? Although gold gain is the most ubiquitous one, there are more new glitches that would need to be fixed. What message does this send to those who would seek to fix them?

Regardless, I'm not worried. I'm just trying to get people to notice this thread. No matter who they are or what their reasons are, those who vote against fixing glitches are always going to be a minority. This being said, I have enabled the option to change your vote. Should sanity come back to you, you can switch to voting towards fixing the problems instead of defending them.

[Merex]

-Topic starts with a troll title => Already convinces me this isn't serious.
-Gold gain is still +2 are you to say it's faster overall? Any proof of that?
-Making a big deal over something that's been unnoticed up until this very post.
-Does it make a big impact on games? Has their been any complaints on it that you can provide?

I said I don't see a need for this in the sense that this situation is being taken more seriously than it probably is. So if you can, answer the above.

[Sylvanas]

-Topic starts with a troll title => Already convinces me this isn't serious.
-Gold gain is still +2 are you to say it's faster overall? Any proof of that?
-Making a big deal over something that's been unnoticed up until this very post.
-Does it make a big impact on games? Has their been any complaints on it that you can provide?

I said I don't see a need for this in the sense that this situation is being taken more seriously than it probably is. So if you can, answer the above.

Make up your mind, am I taking this too seriously or not enough? The title was a mistake, which is why I changed it (mostly so people can better tell what it's about in advance). To clear things up, I'm taking the problem seriously, but I wasn't taking this suggestion seriously. I still just don't see how this should be up for debate and I still consider all of this to be a technicality. The map is broken, I'm just suggesting to fix it and the fix is right here.

Anyway yeah, the passive gold gain is messed up, as I said. I'm not just making this up and suggesting to switch to an identical map for the hell of it. If you'd like to confirm, go download and watch any random dota replay from the ban requests, watch it from the point of view of a player, and see the gold and seconds go up at a completely different pace. The gold moves up by 2 and the seconds by 1, but at different speeds. As an example, if you let 10 replay seconds pass, you'd see the gold would have gone up by much more than the intended 20. If you try the linked map instead, you'll see the gold goes up by 2 exactly at the same moment the seconds go up by one.

Because the glitch is very subtle, since it's the kind that slowly builds up through the game instead of appearing as a specific, visible event, a lot of the more casual players probably haven't noticed it, although they'd probably recognize getting gold has felt much easier lately if you pointed it out to them. However, it's false to say no one has noticed it until now. It's been well known since the first days of 1.29, and everyone is basically just dealing with it, even though they shouldn't have to. Notice the date on my first thread about this very subject.

Finally, it does make a big impact on games. While EM already makes heavy carries stronger than they normally should be by letting them get their items sooner, this glitch makes it even worse. Over 1 hour, everyone gets about 4000 extra gold that they shouldn't. Because of that, a hero like medusa which basically ends the game by becoming farmed enough is much stronger than before and reaches that point several minutes sooner, and farming an early hard to build item (ie: radiance) is much easier. Because of that, I've been encountering many teams with double and triple radiances in my games lately... Making them has been so easy that people don't even bother thinking before doing it.

I hope this clears up some things. I'm not aiming for people to vote my way, it's already inevitable. I want to see the "don't change" votes disappear.

Edit: Instead, a new "don't change" appeared. There can't be too many of those left to cast votes. Do you have a spokesperson that can explain why you're so opposed to fixing a glitch that affects every game?

[EdgeOfChaos]

Well the reasons you stated are exactly the reasons people are voting against it. Extra passive gold allows people who can't or don't lasthit to make items, when they otherwise couldn't. Combine with a braindead autoattack hero and you win more often than before. People would want 20 gold per second if they could have it. Same reason people strongly resist changing to non-EM.

[Sylvanas]

Well the reasons you stated are exactly the reasons people are voting against it. Extra passive gold allows people who can't or don't lasthit to make items, when they otherwise couldn't. Combine with a braindead autoattack hero and you win more often than before. People would want 20 gold per second if they could have it. Same reason people strongly resist changing to non-EM.

Those are the kind of people who may still not even know and who don't look too far into things. Less likely to wind up here. I don't think that's the 4 of them. I have theories, but it doesn't really matter. It's a shame people can vote anonymously on everything nowadays, how the hell are you supposed to know who's legs to break?

Oh well, now we just wait a bit longer, a few more people stumble here and vote to fix, it gets done because the vast majority is for it and because the other option is to pick a broken map over a fixed one for no reason.

[Ziadoma]

+1 bring it back.